Toyota Camry. Альтернатива? (4/4) / Вибір автомобіля

Lexy | патриарх

Re: географію спершу б вивчив :)

[Re: Банзай] 22 апреля 2007 в 23:27

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А к чему тогда были разговоры о S-классе в контексте обсуждаемого Хундая?

А к тому, что Грандюер по размерам S-класс.

А волга по размерам - Е класс

YuriY | ;)

Re: географію спершу б вивчив :)

[Re: Lexy] 22 апреля 2007 в 23:30

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А к чему тогда были разговоры о S-классе в контексте обсуждаемого Хундая?

А к тому, что Грандюер по размерам S-класс.

А волга по размерам - Е класс

запорожец - это почти гольф-класс

_KD_ | V.I.P

Re: географію спершу б вивчив :)

[Re: Банзай] 23 апреля 2007 в 04:58

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А к чему тогда были разговоры о S-классе в контексте обсуждаемого Хундая?

А к тому, что Грандюер по размерам S-класс.

По кругу решил пойти?

По размеру он тоже к S-классу не относится, а относится к тому же классу, что и Камря.

sas59 | новичок

Re: географію спершу б вивчив :)

[Re: _KD_] 23 апреля 2007 в 05:44

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Кстати, по омериканской классификации Азера относится к midsize, а 600 и 7хх - к large. Так шо даже над размерчиком им еще надо работать.

А я Азеру с 600-м никогда и не сравнивал. Только с Лексусом ES, а он тоже вроде как midsize...

так если сравнивать машины только по размерам так Азера сопостовима и с GS и с 5 серия и Е и RL и TL:) в США Азеру сравнивают с Avalon, Ford Five Hundred , Buick Lucerne, Chrysler 300...и в этой компании она смотрится неплохо..а до Upscale\luxury cars ещё не тянет. так и не пытается:)

500, 300 и Люцерна относятся к large.

Consumer Reports помещает ее в группу к вышеперечисленной компании. лень открывать сайты и сравнивать, на вид Азера крупнее Сamry,а вообще пёс с ними, какая разница,не нравится и не тойота и не хундай- я покупаю только хонды..

_KD_ | V.I.P

Re: географію спершу б вивчив :)

[Re: sas59] 23 апреля 2007 в 07:20

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Кстати, по омериканской классификации Азера относится к midsize, а 600 и 7хх - к large. Так шо даже над размерчиком им еще надо работать.

А я Азеру с 600-м никогда и не сравнивал. Только с Лексусом ES, а он тоже вроде как midsize...

так если сравнивать машины только по размерам так Азера сопостовима и с GS и с 5 серия и Е и RL и TL:) в США Азеру сравнивают с Avalon, Ford Five Hundred , Buick Lucerne, Chrysler 300...и в этой компании она смотрится неплохо..а до Upscale\luxury cars ещё не тянет. так и не пытается:)

500, 300 и Люцерна относятся к large.

Consumer Reports помещает ее в группу к вышеперечисленной компании. лень открывать сайты и сравнивать, на вид Азера крупнее Сamry,а вообще пёс с ними, какая разница,не нравится и не тойота и не хундай- я покупаю только хонды..

Посколько "уважаемая противная сторона" настаивала на использовании именно официальной классификации и именно по размеру, посчитал необходимым побуквоедствовать.

mobile_n_9 | старожил

Re:

[Re: _KD_] 26 апреля 2007 в 13:12

Врде как я спрашывал о ТОЙОТЕ КАМРИ!!!

Hunter | Супер писатель!

Re:

[Re: mobile_n_9] 26 апреля 2007 в 14:14

В последнем "Автопарке" Муляр,как раз и тестил:Теану,Кемри,Галант,Суперб-победила Кемря

BigL | member

Re: Toyota Camry. Альтернатива?

[Re: mobile_n_9] 27 апреля 2007 в 14:42

Вообще-то в США Камри сравнивали с Вектрой http://www.autoweek.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070126/FREE/70118010
правда, у Вектры (Сатурн Аура) там движек такой:
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Jim Fets / www.fetsphoto.com

Double Take
Saturn Aura vs. Toyota Camry

AutoWeek | Updated: 01/26/07, 11:06 am et
Photo Gallery:

>> PHOTO GALLERY >>

Some new car models have more riding on them than others. Such is the case with the redone sixth-generation Toyota Camry and the new Saturn Aura. Expectations for these vehicles couldn’t be higher, since both figure heavily into each company’s plans.

The Camry needs to retain bragging rights as America’s best-selling car and to help elevate Toyota to the throne of the biggest carmaker in the world.

The Aura is seen as a turnaround player for the Saturn brand and a major component for a struggling General Motors to fend off Toyota’s challenge for the title of biggest carmaker. Oh, and each wants to aim for the jugular of the other.

Pressure? We would say so.

So we brought a copy of each to California Speedway to participate in our latest DoubleTake and to help answer the question that’s haunting midsize-sedan shoppers everywhere: Which is better, the latest version of Toyota’s perennial favorite or the new entry from resurgent Saturn?

A look at the spec sheets shows little disparity. Our test cars are both equipped with range-topping dual-overhead-cam V6 powerplants and six-speed automatic transmissions. The Toyota’s slightly smaller 3.5-liter displacement wins in the horsepower column with 268 hp to the Saturn’s 252 hp from a 3.6-liter unit. In torque, Aura barely edges Camry, 251 lb-ft to 248.

Underneath, both use similar suspension setups to keep the wheels planted up front with MacPherson struts. In back, Aura carries over the four-link suspension from the Opel Vectra.

Camry makes do with a dual-link unit in the rear.

Dimensionally, the Saturn rides on a longer, 112.3-inch wheelbase, while the Toyota sits on 109.3. Inside, the Toyota offers a total of 101.4 cubic feet of passenger volume, 3.7 more than the Saturn’s 97.7 thanks to slightly larger height and width dimensions. Cargo capacities are also close, with Aura offering 15.7 cubic feet to Camry’s 14.5 cubic feet of storage.

On the track, the Toyota drew first blood. From a standstill to 60 mph, the Camry clocked a best time of 6.22 seconds, 0.33 faster than the Aura’s 6.55, no doubt hampered by its extra 164 pounds of mass. Quarter-mile tests had the Camry going 3.7 mph quicker and beating the Aura to the timing lights by 0.47 second. Neither car exhibited any notable torque steer down the drag strip, which impressed one tester to say it was “quite an achievement given this much power. It just tracks straight ahead without need for any correction from me [when driving the Aura].” But neither did any tester mention torque steer in the Camry.

The slalom also saw the Camry besting the Aura with its run through the tight cones at a 43.3-mph top speed, while the Aura managed 42.7 mph. Testers noted that the inability to fully disable the Camry’s traction and stability controls slowed runs and hurt potential performance. Though the Aura was slower around the cones, testers applauded its surefootedness and said it felt perfectly manageable without using traction and stability control, but they wished for increased steering and tire response.

Around the skidpad, Camry was easily controllable using both steering inputs and throttle to modify its line to exhibit moderate understeer. Traction and stability programs again came into play but were fairly unobtrusive for this exercise to pull 0.77 g.

The Saturn showed the same degree of understeer but was slower to respond to changes in steering and throttle. “You have to move the steering wheel quite a bit for very little return,” according to one tester. In the end, the Aura’s wider rubber did pay dividends to better the Camry with 0.81 g. “This car feels a lot more stable on the skidpad than the Camry; the line is a lot more stable, less nervous,” said one tester.

Camry’s brakes quickly and smoothly hauled it down from 60 mpg in 113 feet, putting it on par with the Lotus Elise we tested last year that did it in 111 feet and the Chevrolet Corvette Z06’s 112-foot stop. Aura came to a halt 16 feet after the Camry, needing 129 feet.

During real-world driving, we found the vehicles comparable, neither showing much freeway hop, torque steer or dive under braking. Staffers preferred Aura’s fun and more composed everyday ride quality over Camry’s comparatively twitchy ride. The Toyota wins the green award for a slightly smaller petroleum appetite than the thirstier American.

Moneywise, the Aura holds an advantage over its Japanese challenger, with the XR coming in at nearly $4,300 less than the Camry’s as-tested price. When removing some of the Camry’s options to bring it more in line with the tested Aura’s equipment level, the advantage drops to about $1,900.

Inside, Aura held the upper hand and impressed the staff with high-quality materials equal to Camry’s and great overall build quality. One staff member said the Aura had “nice tight panel fits that are as tight, if not tighter, than the Camry. They’ve done a nice job with this.”

When we first drove an Aura (Has Saturn Finally Hit Its Target? AW Aug. 14), several people who saw the car thought they might be looking at an Acura.

One staffer expressed disappointment in the quality of Camry materials, saying, “There’s a surprising degree of cheapness on the Camry, something I didn’t expect,” and continued by asking, “Is Toyota losing it?” This was in response to the trunk interior, with what he described as the car’s ratty-fiber-lined wheel wells and black-painted Styrofoam blanking out the hinge areas.

On styling, our staff tips its hat to the Aura. Its design reminds us of the previously mentioned Vectra. In the August introduction story, we called Aura “a handsome car, clean with a bit of jewelry to declare this isn’t the plain-Jane basic transportation that was Saturn’s forte.” We still feel the same way.

Proclaiming a winner is difficult. The Camry won all of the performance tests except the skidpad. However, day-to-day testing had us walking away in favor of the Aura’s superior on-road manners, interior, styling and value.

While we are enthusiasts at heart, Camry’s performance edge is mostly small except in braking. As for what ultimately sells cars in this segment, Aura has strong credentials. The performance advantages of Camry are not significant enough to overlook its vanilla styling, cheapish details, higher price point and poorer ride quality compared to the Aura’s.

Saturn won’t overthrow Toyota for title of best seller, but it now has a strong package in Aura to start winning over skeptics and making them into believers, as it did with us. In the end, Aura is the better choice.

More Views

Aura is a clear winner in my book. The interior is well done, and the two-tone leather looks great. Neither car is really sporty, but the Camry feels bigger and less nimble than the Aura. Go drive both, and I bet most will bring the Saturn home. PHIL FLORADAY

I found the Aura more surefooted, with superior steering response and sportier powertrain and suspension. The interior often tips the scales to Aura, but to me the Saturn’s trump card lies in details like the double-sealed trunk. When little separates you from the competition, it’s the little things that count. BOB GRITZINGER

I would go for the Aura. At $26,919, it looks better than a Camry that costs more. Plus, I like the ride and handling from its Opel Vectra-based chassis. WES RAYNAL

Camry will sell more despite our preference for the Aura because Toyota has the proven formula: a roomier cabin, strong performance (brakes matter) and features like a rear seat armrest and cabin air filter. Its extra cost can be offset by fuel economy and a record of reliability. Saturn’s stunner merits Car of the Year, but the evolved Camry builds on Toyota’s enormous strength. KEVIN A. WILSON

Jim Fets / www.fetsphoto.com

2007 Saturn Aura XR

BASE (INCLUDES $650 DELIVERY): $24,595
AS-TESTED PRICE: $26,919

ENGINE
Front-transverse 3.6-liter/217-cid dohc V6
Output: 252 hp @ 6400 rpm, 251 lb-ft @ 3200 rpm
Compression ratio: 10.2:1
Fuel requirement: 87 octane

DRIVETRAIN
Front-wheel drive
Transmission: Six-speed automatic
Final drive ratio: 2.77:1
Если умеете читать, то машины в тесте стоят на одном уровне (тормозной путь у Кмри меньше на 5 м). Правда, комплектации и интерьер Вектры (собственно, как и Кмри) отличаются от Европейских

BigL | member

Re: Toyota Camry. Альтернатива?

[Re: BigL] 27 апреля 2007 в 15:02

Sorry, выбросил больше, чем хотел. В Америке действительно высоко ценят немецкое качество и уважают Порше и Мерсы (кто может себе позволить их купить). Америка - не только Брайтон (я бываю там часто в разных городах более 10 лет). Отношение к авто утилитарное, для них нет разницы - японское или корейское авто, лишь бы цена соотв. качеству. Кстати, Хюндай (по отзывам экспертов и опросам конс. фирм)в США не уступает по качеству другим брендам, но дешевле (как и КИА) поэтому я их там видел много. Понятно, что GM Saturn Aura (Vectra) и Toyota Camry там несколько другие, чем в Европе (особенно в интерьере)

_KD_ | V.I.P

Re:

[Re: mobile_n_9] 28 апреля 2007 в 02:06

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Врде как я спрашывал о ТОЙОТЕ КАМРИ!!!

Ой, кто здесь?

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Toyota Camry. Альтернатива? (4/4)

Toyota Camry. Альтернатива? (4/4)

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